Ep.96 Co-Creating Food Sovereignty with Spence Madden

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Hello, Hello, everyone! Welcome back to another episode of ReConnect with Plant Wisdom. It’s me, Tigrilla Gardenia.

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Oh, my goodness, this is such a good episode such a good episode! I am so excited to be bringing to you Spence Madden, and his frequency gardening, electroculture.

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There is just so much to be said about this. Basically, Spence is on a mission. He’s on a mission to create food, sovereignty, high frequency, amazing food. But more than anything, what I loved about this conversation is that we took gardening outside of the idea of knowledge and neat rows, and into pure

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co-creation with nature. We talked so deeply about the importance of creating the relationship with the different beings that will be inhabiting your garden with the plants that want to come in about how to do this, and how to create food, whether it’s a small container on your patio, or whether it’s a giant multi acre lot that you have

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any of it, if it’s co-created, will give you such a different relationship with the plants.

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There’s so much that I want to say about this. So before I, you know, continue to ramble on. I’m just going to let Spence tell you himself. So this is episode 96. Co-creating food, sovereignty with Spence Madden.

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Welcome to ReConnect with Plant Wisdom. I’m your host, Tigrilla Gardenia, nature-inspired mentor, certified life coach and the founder of the naturally conscious community.

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For over a decade. I’ve been known as a world ambassador for plant advocacy, working closely with plants to share their practical wisdom, to help you consciously embody the elements of life that nourish your evolution. In this podcast I delve into ancient and modern knowledge, from biology to spirituality, about the wondrous ways of plants.

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Together, we’ll explore how ecosystem thinking helps you overcome limiting beliefs, understand the true nature of relationships, and live an authentic, impactful life.

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All right, we are here. It’s been a bit of an Odyssey for all of you like. We’ve had just a few technical glitches today. But you know what I’m going to take what Spence just said at the very right before I hit the record button, which is now I’m all amped, and this is going to be even better, and I have no doubt for that. So, Spence, before I start asking you a billion one questions that I already have lined up. Can you tell the audience who you are? Who who is Spence?

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Well, thank you so much for having me again. I feel like we’ve been navigating the tech stuff. So it makes the conversation that much more better. Hello to all you beautiful listeners out there. My name is Spence Madden. I’m the founder of aether garden technologies and the learn electroculture educational platform, and

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it’s really my vision for

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humanity to become food sovereign. I’ve always been interested in gardening. I’ve always been interested in the discrepancy between the quote unquote halves of food abundance, and, let’s say, the 1st world and those who may be starving in 3rd World nations. This always has felt very interesting to me, and it led me on a path of

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playing my own role in looking at, how can we actually solve these challenges of food inequality and move into the state of food abundance. Now.

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as I went on this journey.

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it became very apparent to me that our ability to create food sovereignty for ourselves, our families and our communities was inextricably linked to the ability for us to evolve spiritually for us to expand our consciousness, for us to become, you know, more integrated, embodied

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in our life’s journey. Because the fact of the matter is, if you don’t have food sovereignty, if you don’t have food that’s nutritious and high life force available to you and your family. It puts you into states of survival, and we know when people are in states of survival, our consciousness tends to

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contract, and this makes it much harder for us to continue our spiritual evolution as beings. So a lot of my work over the past number of years has gone into. Well, how do we create food sovereignty? How do we make it more accessible for the person who’s awakening and wants to get into garden and is feeling the big changes on planet Earth. Maybe you’ve grown a garden a little bit before, and you want to do it in

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harmony with nature, because guess what? I think we can all agree. The industrial Big Agriculture complex has caused more harm than good to this planet. So let’s learn together to grow food in abundance in a new way, in harmony with nature. And this to me, is how we’re going to end up with a truly free, expanded humanity.

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There are so many directions. I want to take everything you just said so already, because there is the area of

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the difference. I’ll put it in this context. I was just having a conversation with a client yesterday about this, because she was talking to me about

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you know, low, level fear and anxiety, that type of fear and anxiety that we believe that we sort of almost born with. And she was talking about how that comes from like she was saying to me, you know, because that comes from the fact that Hunter, gatherer culture was all about the fear of not having enough food and other stuff, and I stopped her. And I said, You do realize that that’s been debunked in the sense that hunter gatherer culture. If you go back through the literature. And you really go into the latest of the research is about the fact that

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they actually worked for a very short period of time because they were so connected to the land. They knew the land so well that they knew where the animals were. They knew where the plants, the edible plants were, and so therefore they worked, maybe for a day maximum a week, and then they took a month off

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to enjoy. They were actually much more calm. It’s all because of that relationship. So that’s 1 area of the whole conversation and the other area that I’d love to talk to. And I’m going to ask you questions about which is all about.

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you know the quality of our food and the difference between what we’re eating today and and what we’re eating when you go to the supermarket and buy, and the type of food that comes from the deep relationship that you’re talking about. So I’m giving you the option. Where do we start?

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Yeah, I think. Let’s let’s go into more of like the hunter gatherer. The past approach to start, and then we’ll move forward to the modern day when you were speaking there it very much.

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I agree with it, and often we look at, you know, hunter, gatherer cultures as this, you know, some not very advanced, you know. They didn’t build these big buildings and things like that. But I you know it has always amazed me. This idea of being so in tune with your surroundings and your nature that you actually have no

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real desire to build these big things because you are creating and interacting with nature in different levels that actually diminishes that. And this ties into

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what’s happened in mainstream agriculture is we’ve allowed the human ego to get completely unchecked, and this has led to all the degradation, the toxicity, the low, nutrient values, the degraded soil. But back in hunter-gatherer times, where you were so in tune with the land.

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You really didn’t have any of that. You could go out into the forest and, like you said you could spend an hour a day, knowing exactly and during what season and what location, that you’d be able to find beautiful berries, or game or fish, whatever it may be, in such abundance, and because we were, they were so in tune with the land. The ego hadn’t been raging.

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and it led to the sacred circle of life. This idea of the humans being

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in the ecosystem not above the ecosystem. It reminds me I had this one company about a decade ago. We were involved with ethical beekeeping and stuff like this, and it was called Eco, not ego. And we had this one shirt, and on one side it said Eco! And it was a silhouette of a human, with all the animals around it in this circle.

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and then it said, not ego, and on the ego side it had the human standing above, outside of this circle of animals and trees and plants, and that literally, that simple image has summed up what has happened from the past to forward. We’ve stepped out of being seeing ourselves as part of the ecosystem, an integral part, a steward, a keeper.

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never taking more than we actually need returning and bringing balance to the ecosystem to where we are now, where it’s mass mechanization, chemicals, spraying, shipping food across the world rather than getting it locally.

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Yeah, absolutely. And it’s it’s almost as if this one moment of fear kind of had this cascade of effects all the way through. Somebody at some point got scared that they weren’t going to have enough. Maybe there was a winter, a famine of some sort, or some weather that was completely unexpected. You know, the climate changing and moving in certain directions, and humans not being able to. And all of a sudden

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that became like the model we should go to. And we fed into this fear. Oh, yeah. And that fear has continued to propagate on, over and over again. And not only that, we rewrite the past, because.

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like I said, my client was talking to me about well, my low, level fear is completely normal and natural, because even in Hunter and I was like, Whoa, stop! You’ve been fed, unfortunately, a piece of information. If you read books like stone age economics. If you go into the anthropological research, you will discover that that was not it. There was a lot of contemplation

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presence. Those things that you recover once you start spending large times in nature right when I spend time with plants, when I spend time going out and experiencing the natural world all of a sudden, I naturally don’t want to take more than I need. It’s not a thing I have to discipline myself into. It is something that just

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happens because I enter into a different rhythm and a symbiosis that allows me to take.

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but it also kind of almost encourages me from the inside out to give, and I become part of that cycle that keeps moving forward. And it really does change and shift your perspective. And I’m amazed at how many

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gardeners

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actually lose even this like, in other words. And and this is where I want to get really deep into your work, because I find that unfortunately, a lot of people are like, Oh, yeah, I’m connected because I’m a gardener, and it’s like Whoa. I know a lot of gardeners that unfortunately are really connected to the idea of control. Let me control my yield. Let me control the quality, the quantity to the color, the shape, the speed.

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She’s the where you are, and all these pieces, and it’s almost like we’re expressing even more of that dominion. And yet and then so there’s not even that benefit coming back and forth, and I’d love to know. How is it that you approach like, what is this electroculture sort of gardening that takes people into a completely different approach?

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Yeah, exactly. I couldn’t agree more. And this is honestly this approach to gardening, growing food.

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I truly think we’re infants at babies. We’re at just the 0 point 5% of what is possible when it comes to actually being so connected. As if, as our ancestors were. So I’m going to be the 1st one to say, I don’t really think and feel that there’s anyone who’s a quote unquote expert in some of the fields, some of the areas of exploration I am in. I think we’re all learning. So I really want to preface that to

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you, listener out there to encourage you that this is an experiment. This is a remembering. This is a relearning. It requires curiosity. It requires being open-minded. It requires

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changing.

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some of the conventional programming. I like to call it, like the Rockefeller way of growing food, very mechanized with.

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you know, coming back into harmony with the land, and you hit the nail on the head we love to impose. I call it like imposition gardening. Where? And we do this subconsciously, and I still unwinding this. You know I’ve gone to the permaculture trainings. I’ve done my own permaculture trainings, I’ve you know, worked on clients gardens, I’ve just, and this and that, and I’m still

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still catching myself, as I’m outside saying, Hey, I am going to do this, and that’s a big that’s like a big catch right there. I am going to do this. Then the approach that I’ve been inviting myself into, and I invite those in my audiences to is

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well, instead of saying that, why don’t we say like, what does nature want me to grow here? What would thrive here. And this, this really changes the game, because you’re not necessarily going to say I’m going to plant all of my onions at this time in this row in this location, because that’s what feels good from the permaculture book that I studied by the fire in the winter.

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No, no, it’s it’s going and tuning into the land and receiving what I call sign synchronicities and messages from nature that will direct you

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what to plant, when to plant, how to plant, how to arrange it, how to water it all these different things. So that moves us into what I call Co. Creative gardening. And this to me is this new wave of co-creative gardening? There’s actually a

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a really beautiful teacher that I recommend everyone out there who’s on a resonance. What we’re talking about. Check out. Her name’s Michelle Wright, and she really started growing her grant her eco sanctuary in

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Virginia. I think it was in like the 19 seventies, and she wrote a book called Behaving as if the god in all life mattered, and she coined that term co-creative gardening, and her whole methodology and whole approach was to take.

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They take her ego out of it, and to actually be fully directed by nature in everything, and she did a multi-decade experiment of unwinding her imposition, nature, her desire to dominate her garden, and to truly receive

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and then create from that space. And her journey is very amazing. And I think it’s just a snapshot of what is possible for us as we go forward as gardeners creating food sovereignty

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I absolutely love that because I think that that’s the big piece that is missing. I live, as I’ve told you. I live in Dominhur, which is, you know, one of the largest spiritual communities. And we have, you know, a lot of different gardening type in the sense of a lot of different forms of agriculture. We have one nucleo which is one of our territories and our shared homes that is completely dedicated to agriculture, and then we have other

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ones that are just have some small gardens or greenhouses or different aspects. And over the years we’ve had more or less, we even had an experiment that we call oliocaldo, which technically means hot oil, which was an entire year, where people lived in one of our, you know, shared homes, and you could only use what you

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had. In other words, what was grown animals that were grown, everything from clothing, everything. The people they switched out. There was only one or 2 people that one person that lived the entire year there other people would switch for like a month.

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and they would spend time. But the whole experiment was, if you were only going to live off the land. What would it be? And I, it’s interesting to watch even here, as we, as you very much said, we call ourselves a laboratory for humanity because we’re very much a laboratory. We’re not perfect. We make a lot of mistakes. We come in with our own conditioning. There are some people here that are like, you know.

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generations of gardeners or of farmers who have done things in a certain way, and it’s very interesting to see as we shift and experiment? And when do we let space happen, and which are the ones that are still controlling? And how does that really affect? And what what does it mean to actually be in relationship with the land? What does it mean to actually

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sit with the beings of that place? For example, one of the people here. Unfortunately, she passed a few years ago. She was an expert. She was one of the experts, an Italian expert on wild herbs and wild edibles of this area of the mountains. She was one of those people that really knew the plants so well.

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I love that. And she would go walking across the mountain, and she would see certain kinds of plants, and she would ask them like, Do you want me to

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propagate? You help you kind of continue on, because, you know, climate change and changing mountain, and people moving, and all kinds of different aspects, has made some of these wild herbs and some of these wild plants very difficult to continue to grow in their native environments, and it was always really interesting to have a conversation with her, because.

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besides the fact that she had a lot of information and knowledge, but it was also something I think she struggled to try to explain to people her relationship because

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it came from a different place. If you were to go into her garden, and if you were to go into her greenhouses they look like a mess. Anybody who’s here who likes the manicured garden? Who likes that greenhouse? That’s orderly hated going, they would say. It’s an eyesore, and it took me until my plant, reawakening to walk in there and be like.

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oh, this isn’t messy! This is what the plants are asking. Exactly. This is nature. This is what the plants are asking of her. They are asking, and even though she’s putting them in pots, maybe, and leaving them. But it’s not abandoning them. It’s a different. It’s so hard to put into words, and I remember that every time she would cook they were her and her husband excellent cooks.

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and it was a different quality of food. It was a different way to eat. It’s so hard to put into words

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because you felt it, and if you were disconnected, what I found, and I find this a lot. If you’re still disconnected. You see, messy, you see unexplainable. You see something that’s confusing. If you’re connected. You see flow. You see natural expression, you feel and taste relationship. It’s such a different thing.

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Yeah, I couldn’t agree more. What a beautiful knowledge holder. And you know at that time, you know.

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it is a little kind of weird and woo woo like we we were laughing about before we started the call to say, I’m going to sit down and communicate with plants like I will be the 1st one to say there is not a single person in my extended family that

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like they would look at me weird at the Christmas talking about that. They don’t even get how I have like an actual business around some of this stuff no less, you know, going out barefoot, meditating. You know. The term they like to use is they call me crunchy granola, like kind of that hippie sort of energy. But it’s not. It’s the way of the ancients is the way of the ancestors, and I truly believe it is the way back home to

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humanity’s role as sacred protectors and guardians of Gaia, this planet, this this area of I said, the the universe that we are in, and

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we’ve been almost wholly disconnected. And now we are reconnecting, and to me it’s a multifaceted approach to

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reconnect. Now a big piece is going and learning from the knowledge holders like this woman that you you reference to have that connection and reverence, and

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being in stewardship and asking right, asking the questions from a place of humble. Why do you do this? Can you tell me about this? I would love to learn because they’re the ones who’ve normalized this for much of their life. It’s also about you and the plant and the garden and the forest and the mountain relationship, one on one. It’s about going out and learning and turning on what I call the higher human senses, which

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you know, we often think that being clairvoyant or being psychic, or having super high intuition, is.

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you know, something that someone who might have an energy healing business does. But these are all gifts that are available to people who go outside and spend time

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quietly. And then, of course, I say, let’s let’s look at the beautiful modern day permaculture practices in the books and the workshop, because there’s a lot of value in that. But what I see is not a merging of all of these different aspects, the ancient wisdom you with nature and these modern, you know these modern techniques very often, and as you reference that, you see, people will come very

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locked in a certain way, because they’ve had 30 years of growing grapes this way. But 30 years of growing grapes this way is amazing, like, let’s I love talking with people who do it. When let me like one of my great one of the greatest ways that I’ve learned to come into more stewardship with the land is when I have someone who clearly has known something for a long time.

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I ask questions, and I shut up and listen, and I just absorb it all, and then I find my own truth in it, and what resonates. And this is why you can carry a lot of knowledge. But we have to be careful that just because somebody has done it for 30 years doesn’t mean that in this next season that the grapes, the land, the community is going to want to grow and produce grapes

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that way we have a lot of changes happening. We have changes with the planetary alignments. We have changes with the radiation coming off the sun. We have changes coming from the heartbeat of the universe or the heartbeat of the earth. Right. This human resonance is moving from that consistent 7.8 3 hertz towards 8 like this is, there’s so many factors. We have the spraying of the skies, the toxification agenda. We have natural climate, evolution. All of these things

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are happening, so we must become humble stewards of the land, and learn the signs, synchronicities, what nature wants to share in order to thrive. How we did it is not how I think we’re going to do it in the immediate to short term coming decades.

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So getting into a little bit, because here’s the thing

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we all know, like not everybody can live on you. Have you? Let me say it this way? Let me back up and say it right. You have the people who want to go off and do a homestead right, who have all the best of intentions. And they’re thinking I’m going to go. Take the permaculture. Course I’m going to go take, you know, permaculture design, or I’m going to go take you know what you would call it intuitive gardening, like there’s so many other. There’s so many other techniques.

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Also, what’s Steiner’s technique? I can’t even remember now, biodynamic. Thank you. That’s a big one around here. Biodynamic. I’m going to go. Take all these things, and then, of course, these these books and these classes teach them. You do it this way. You do it this way. You do it this way. You put this on the bottom, you put this on the top, you put this in the middle, which is, you know better than mass agriculture. But as we’re talking about, there’s

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and then there’s the people who say, I really want to have some level. Okay, I can’t. I can’t go off and live in the middle of the countryside, but I want to create something that is at my scale, which could be, you know, a little allotment. It could be a

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plot, you know, around my house. It could even just be a container, some container gardens outside of my home. So my question is, where do they start? How does somebody come about if somebody comes to you? And they say in either one of these scenarios, and they say to you. I want to create something that is in relationship more than anything I want to feel like what I am putting. If I’m going to

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sacrifice. If a being is going to sacrifice their life like a plant, is sacrificing their life to be eaten, I want to ensure that they are living their absolute, bestest life, and that we are in a relationship of mutual nourishment. How do I go about and do this?

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Yeah, I like it all. And I think the big thing is when people come to me and they say, Spence, can I do this right? This, this co-creative gardening, this energy frequency and vibrational gardening, frequency gardening. Can I do it in a backyard? Can I do on a wind sill? Can I do it on my 10 acre place? And the big thing is, you can grow food. You can be in relationship with plant and plus. This extends to what I call the biodiversity piece. And this is growing

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plants

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just simply because they’re beautiful. And you want to support your ecosystem. It doesn’t even have to be that you’re going to harvest this plant. You can.

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You can do this frequency gardening anywhere, and for me it always starts with when they come. They’re like, I want to do this. I want to do that. It always starts with me asking like, Have you actually got quiet on your land like, if you want to go and you want to grow herbs on a windowsill in

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New York City?

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Have you gone out to your windowsill? Have you put your hands on that little railing where you’re going to put your little container over? And have you actually tuned in to nature and saying, Hey, because nature is everything right like nature, we think.

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is found, is just deep in an untamed wild forest, but like the entire planet, is nature moving? So you’ve got to go in and tap in, and that can be as simple as closing your eyes and asking like, what does nature want on this windowsill?

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It’s also, if you’re planting a new garden, go get your bare feet on the ground, and be quiet and start asking questions. And with this, especially as your multidimensional, you know, your spiritual intuition continues to increase. You will receive messages. Then what I say do

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is actually a I call it like a Trinity approach. Once you’ve started like the key is, we all always start with the asking a question. Start with the bare feet on the land, start getting quiet.

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because that’s just you in relationship to the land and plant.

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then go inside. And just I call it automatic writing. Just write down whatever’s coming down, scribble out plans. Maybe it’ll be you’ll get an idea, and it’ll say, grow garlic in the corner. Just write that down. Maybe you’ll get your get an idea to do a garden bed, whatever it is. Let let what you think? Come out because that’s nature coming

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through you? Then we can go and say, Okay, great. This seems good. I like this. Maybe I should look a little bit at some. The permaculture principles, you know, those 12 principles that are just amazing for guiding diversity and resiliency when it comes to creating a project doesn’t matter if it’s a little windowsill box doesn’t matter if we’re building like a full terraced rice garden on a slope. Those principles

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have been proven, and, interestingly enough, are rooted directly rooted to the aborigines of Australia.

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rooted right to them. They were using these principles eons and eons ago.

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Then we can look at it and say, Okay, this is a beautiful filter or a lens that can help create resiliency. I want to apply this to what I just wrote down, okay, great. Now we have a little bit more layers. We got a little bit more built off. Now, if you feel called, maybe you read a permaculture book. You took a course then from there. Let’s layer some of that on there and then, interestingly enough, and this is where I’m

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you know. I do like to think that I do bring a modern edge in some ways to this conversation, because my next step from there is actually to go and work with AI. If you can believe it, to help generate further ideas. I don’t start with AI, but AI is an amazing tool for gardeners in terms of

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developing and designing. And what I’ll actually do is I’ll take what I thought from the garden and what came through, and I’ll take the permaculture principles, and then I’ll actually go into AI, and I’ll say, Hey, I’m in this location. Please tell me some. You know I want to create a little Tree Guild, right where everything works together, you’re creating some harmonious group of plants that are all going to thrive.

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Give me some examples of this, because if you’re a new gardener out there. You might not know that there’s 30 different types of trees that could potentially thrive on your land, and you might be get a clear message when you’re out on the land that a tree

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guild with some medicine around it is to be planted in this area, but you might not be tuned in enough at that point for it to say, Hey, I want this species of apple tree. Well, this is where AI can be amazing, because you can go and say, Hey, I would love a list of 30 trees that will grow in

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the interior mountains of Western Canada or the mountains of Italy that I could potentially put in here. Then the neat thing is, then you can take that list, find the ones that feel good to you intuitively right. Remember trusting your intuition is being in harmony with nature, because if you’re coming from a open hearted place

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when you look at that list, nature is working through you. When you allow it. You’re going to get your list of, let’s say, 5 or 6. The trees that seem like it would fit your need. Then we can go back out to the land to where you got the message to put in the corner.

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and then you can use techniques like body dousing or l rods, or a pendulum, or simply asking questions. There’s many different ways. You can do it to actually determine what is the optimal tree that nature wants out there, and you can even get it right down to the species.

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And that to me, is this idea of co-creation. It also can help collapse the timeframe. Because if you’re someone who just moves on to a 2 acre property, there’s a lot of things to do. There’s a lot of decisions to be made. And it’s very easy to

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fall into what I call like, almost like task overwhelm where you just start making decisions willy-nilly, without actually asking nature. And then, before you know all your time’s gone, your your crop is subpar. Nature didn’t exactly. You know. It wasn’t really in harmony with nature, and you can, you know, kind of cut. It makes it so you can. You might not have as success as quickly as possible, and I’ll just sum up this little share by you’re going to have more success with creating what I call wildly productive gardens

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from the get go, or no matter where you are, even if you’re established right now by

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training yourself to spend at least 25% of the time you’re allocating to your garden into being in relationship with nature and developing the human higher senses, skills that will bring more messages and communication to you. So said another way, if you have 10 HA week to garden.

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spend 2.5 of those hours actually out there, meditating, body dousing, looking intimately at your plants, receiving messages from the land. Spend the other 7.5 h doing the actual thing, whether it’s digging, sheet, molting, building a new bed, going to the heart. You know the home hardware store to get whatever you may need. And very quickly, when you apply that 25% ratio, you’re going to

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have better decisions. And when you have better decisions that are coming, you know, coming from nature, there is. There is no downside to having more information, because you’re gonna make.

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The projects will be better, the frequency will be stronger, and there will be more yields.

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I want to go back for a second to the conversation you were having about technology. And AI, because I think it’s 1 of those that’s really important to touch on, because I think it’s very easy for people to misunderstand or to almost discount, because, you know, when you enter into a certain direction, such as wanting to connect with nature, it’s almost easy, for you know, it’s almost kind of like

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automatic to say, well, then, that means I have to disown all technology and all kinds of things like that. So I want to. I want to double. I want to double back for a second, because I think it is an important point. Look, most of us

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cannot be experts of everything right, and especially when you’re starting off.

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it takes years, if not decades.

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lifetimes to really be somebody that knows species, to have a very robust like level of understanding of the different types of species. And, like you said, I think it’s very easy. If you read books, you could become very knowledgeable on what people are telling you are the species that are good to grow, regardless of whether or not they’re native or they’re the most adapted, or maybe even the most.

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you know, correct ones for this period of time. I mean, we talk about this with apples all the time. The number of apple species that we actually grow versus the number of apple species that they are exist in the world that are growable is like, it’s such a stark contrast. So I think that the use of technology in the way that you’re talking about is really about saying, first, st allow your download to not just be

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apple species, blah blah or Latin names, or even you don’t even know what kind. You know it could be fruit, and you could receive messages in this type of communication, you know in me with all of my plant communication. I always tell people

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your best friend is a drawing pad, and you know colored pencils or anything that allows you to. Yes, write when words come, but oftentimes to capture things, and you don’t have to be an excellent drawer. It’s not about like I’m going to get a message, and I’m going to see the vision of some plant which could happen right. If you’re really good, you might be able to draw it. But sometimes all you’re going to get is

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colors, characteristics. You’re going to get a feeling of like a seasonality like I might get a really wintry cold feeling. So I write down

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cold. I get a feeling of like a shade of red or of purple. I get all this, and then I might get even scenes of family moments where I’m eating certain things, or I’m going to a restaurant because I love this one dish that they have. And when I start to piece all that together, I realize that that’s nature, you know that that’s the plants themselves.

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using my emotions and my memories to transmit to me a specific species that I don’t know the name of, and therefore sure, if I have a really trusted nursery that I can go to and be like. All right.

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I go to this restaurant with my family every year, and we always eat eggplant. But it’s not your regular eggplant that I see in the supermarket. It’s like because the chef has come and talked to us about it. And I know it’s a specific thing, and I get this feeling of like juiciness, but with a bitter tart in this, and like, maybe you will have a gardening place that knows that.

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But maybe you don’t, and that’s when the AI like you were talking about can be a really great ally, not an end. All be all but a let me enter in Google can also be your friend sometimes, but you know, enter in all these characteristics and say, and don’t be afraid to enter in, especially because you know nobody else is looking at it. But you don’t be afraid to enter in even emotional characteristics something that feels bitter, something that feels harsh.

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something that tastes in this way, something that may be cooked in this area like you can enter all this in, because that’s how nature communicates nature and plants in particular, tap into those memories tap into those emotions, and then they start to stir in there and find things that help

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can, you know, express to you a specific thing, and that’s where the AI can be useful, because you can enter in this random set of parameters, and they could spit out, you know, 5 different species of eggplant that, and then you can narrow it down, saying, Okay, which one of these grow in the area, maybe narrow it down to 2, and then come into the land and sit down with these 2

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and feel again into it like, Okay, I’ve narrowed it down to 2. Are these one of the 2 that you were telling me about. Is this what you’re bringing to me to the surface? So I just wanted to express that because I think it’s so easy for us to.

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you know. Want to say that we’re going to give control to AI, and it’s not that it’s the opposite. It’s giving, using that to give a voice to a nature that is so much more expansive, so much bigger, so much more open to possibilities, than what our human knowledge might be, and therefore entering into this and connecting with that kind of knowledge base can be really useful.

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Yep, yep, the way I see it is.

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If you start with you and your relationship to the land which

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to me is going out in your backyard, going out on your homestead, going out on your balcony going out on your farm, and you start there.

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I don’t really feel like you will ever be led astray, especially when you go out there, and you just set a very like you. One thing I’ve noticed is you will have more success as a frequency gardener

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if you go outside and you set the intention of what you’re doing with the garden, and this is something that I learned from Shayla Wright, who I mentioned before. Is it? Is you need to be precise in what your intention is with creating the garden, because the interesting thing about our relationship with nature is

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nature doesn’t really like, we say, we? We say, Hey, I’m creating a garden, and we assume that this is nature. But nature doesn’t naturally, you know, put up a fence and keep the deer out and grow things in this certain way that that’s a human

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aspect. So when we actually go into that co-creative relationship first, st we’re going to get and receive information from nature. Amazing, then guess what we live in 2025. There is a lot of pressure on everyone right now. Not only are we spiritually awakening our society seems like it’s collapsed, and the financial markets are on the brink, etc. Etc. Etc.

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And your goal here is create food sovereignty for you and your family and your neighbors, so you can thrive, no matter what comes, and be in an elevated place of expansion. So you continue your spiritual work

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there can be a lot to do. I don’t care if you haven’t done a single thing yet. You just feel the call to get that garden growing, or you’ve been doing it for 10 years. There’s 20 years, 30 years. There’s always so much to do. There’s so many decisions to make. There’s

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limitless things to draw our attention away. So why, I don’t see why I wouldn’t want to leverage a powerful tool to help me. I like to say, to help me workshop to help me design to help me co-create things very quickly.

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and then I take that back out to nature, and one of my little pro tips that I always share with people is okay. Let’s say we’ve gone out. We’ve done your process. You mentioned. You know we have our notepad. We wrote our things down. Then we come back in. We sit with it. We say, Okay, I’m going to spend half an hour workshopping on this tool that we call AI. I’m going to get more information. Great. I’ve built a couple guild. I’ve got a couple ideas. I’m feeling excited about this.

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Write those things back down on your notepad, rip those sheets of paper off, and then actually

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go and put it on the land, put a little rock on it, and let it sit there for

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1520 min while you go. Do something else, then come back and use whatever technique you’re using, you know. Maybe, like you said. If you’re more advanced, you’re getting these different type of psychic impressions with your eyes closed for others, people who are just starting out. I find things like body dousing L rods, pendulums can be great tools, and actually figure out and get a yes, a very clear resounding yes, from

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which one of these 3 potential tree guilds you want to put in gets the most strongest resonance. And then, as you get more adept and experience and this might happen quickly. This might happen over multiple years. The key is, you just keep doing that 25% of your time.

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You’ll soon realize. Okay, I’ve got my Guild with 7 things. I got my apple tree. I got a dynamic accumulator. I got something that’s good for pollinators. You’ll actually be able to intuitively know that. Oh, 6 out of 7 of these things in this guild feel really good, but one of them isn’t doesn’t feel like nature quite wants it here. Well, you’ll be able to go through a very quick process and actually determine. Oh,

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This garlic that I was going to plant as a repellent is actually not in harmony. Right? And this is the energy, frequency, and vibration piece of gardening is the frequency is not matching. And you could say co-mingling effectively with those other 6 pieces, and then you can take it out. And the reason we go through this whole process is so that way. In year 7

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that guild is thriving. And this is a permaculture principle. And it’s the idea that okay, great. You want to build this food system. But over time I want, the abundance that is, the yields, the food, the energy, the life force of this system to go up and to increase rapidly.

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And I want my physical time that I need to be digging, that I need to be trimming, that I need to be planting to actually go down and think about this. If we want to go back towards our ancestors more and more, that

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actually spent a lot of time just enjoying nature. This is where I love that the the permaculture approach, because

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you can now step back and say, Okay, instead of putting in 3 h every week in the summer to maintaining the system and keeping it all flowing. It’s largely maintaining itself, and I can step back and either reallocate those 3 h into something else in the garden, or I can take those 3 h and say, now I can spend this on my spiritual practice. I can spend this with my family. I can spend this with my dogs, whatever it may be.

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and that to me is, you know that to me is the beauty of of where we’re going. When we merge all of this modern stuff with all of the ancient stuff with our current heart space.

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Yeah, because in reality, when we go back, you know, in time, I mean to a certain extent, that is what was already happening. Yeah, sure. Okay, it wasn’t. It wasn’t AI in the way that we use it today. But there was always a certain aspect of what is the modern piece that allows me to

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really make use of my time. Our time was different. Back then our relationships were different. Our relationship with the land was different, and also our needs were different. It’s just a different time. So therefore it’s good to bring things into the modern.

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And I also think it’s really important for us to to listen to what arrives. I actually have an entire episode that’s based on tomato and Basil, because Tomato and Basil just showed up at my house. Literally one was brought in by somebody else but tomato, which I don’t even eat, showed up in a

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just literally a pot started to grow, no idea where that came from. And I do think that that also is another aspect of it. And it’s interesting because I did that episode a few, maybe about a month or 2 ago, when I did that episode. The plant’s been with me for a while, and just today I was having. I was cooking like I said, I’m not a big tomato fan, and I was cooking, and I realized that I’ve been using tomato.

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I’ve been using tomato more in my food, and I’ve realized that there’s something different in the relationship with tomato. And as I was cooking today. I was looking out the window and seeing the tomato plant.

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Of course it’s winter here. There’s a whole experiment that’s going in our relationship right now. But the point being is, I was looking at the plan, and I was like, this is your doing, isn’t it like I? Obviously my body needed something different. Tomato came into my life, created some connection, and when I say body, I don’t just mean my physicality. But, like you said, it’s the whole connection, and just today, as I was cooking, I was like

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pouring in a little bit of tomato, and I was like, what am I doing? I would have never done this a year ago if it wasn’t for that relationship. So there is an enrichment that happens in these types of things over time. It isn’t like you, said a spur of the moment. It’s a relationship, it’s a mutual nourishment. It is something that changes you.

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and when you do it. In this way it becomes something that enriches your life in so many different directions

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that you could never expect. It’s not just about what’s on your plate. It is about a complete expansion of your senses. It’s an expansion of the way that you think of what relationships look like

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of trusting your own intuition. There’s just so much that comes when you switch out of the idea that my food is either in the supermarket or coming from neat rows that I plant in this, you know greenhouse that I’ve built, but instead is about no, I’m going to start a deep relationship with place, and therefore all the beings that live in that place wherever they may be.

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And so, Spence, with that I you know, I’m sure, as always, we can always sit here and talk for hours, but I would love. I would absolutely love for you to share with everyone. How do they? I mean, obviously, we’ll put it into the show notes. But how do people get in touch with you? What is it that you offer them? How? Why would they? You know? What do they get when they connect with you, because I know. But I want them to know.

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Yeah, absolutely. I know we could keep going with this conversation. I feel like we could sit around on a couch and talk about this stuff all day, or maybe in the forest. So I look forward to that. If our paths ever cross in person. And yeah, so for the beautiful listener, thank you for your time, and listening to

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our conversation here, I appreciate you. I know there’s a lot of different places that our attention can be placed. So I’m glad that you found this beautiful podcast and co-creation in terms of next steps. If you want to come into my world. We are really pioneering.

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I’m playing a role in what we call the frequency gardening movement. Do we have it all figured out absolutely not. Are we well on our way, and will we figure it out together to create this food abundance across the world? Absolutely. If you are an Instagram. That’s 1 of my main platforms where I’m producing content and all kinds of good stuff on there. So you can find that at just at learn electroculture.

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and I go deeper with frequency gardeners, conscious gardeners who really resonate with this inside of my learn electroculture Academy, which is essentially what we call the number one program for conscious gardeners who want to design implement and harvest wildly productive gardens by harnessing, energy, frequency, and vibration. So our core tenants really are merging

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electroculture, which is the ancient practice of learning to direct the earth’s natural electromagnetic fields into our crops, balancing and harmonizing our land so that way we can see increased, increased harvest, less pests, more resiliency. So that’s the 1st thing we look at, Number 2 is we look at the permaculture piece which I talked to a little bit throughout this audio, being.

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you know, guiding permaculture principles that were popularized in 19 seventies in Australia, which, as I said, actually go back to the indigenous there, so relearning and applying those in harmony with the electroculture, and finally the plant and nature communication piece. So this is the getting on the land. This is the activating of the higher senses. This is

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discovering and training your unique access points. Because we all have these gifts. They just might not look the same. For when it comes to being in relationship with nature, putting all 3 of those together in a very supportive community in real time.

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basically because I want to collapse the timeframe to you and your family’s food, sovereignty and abundance. And I know that we’re doing this one garden at a time, and I see a you know I foresee a reality where down the war, sometime in the future, all of these high frequency gardens.

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all of these gardens where we’ve gotten back into harmony and relationship with nature all across the world. And then, like a giant web, those will become the new normal, and those around us who aren’t using frequency gardening technologies will see the results that are happening on the land by those who are, and they will soon learn, and their children will activate and have higher senses. They’ll naturally be inclined to frequency gardening, and those who are doing it now will become the way showers

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for those when we eventually really create and achieve the goal that I have of 365, 24, 7, every single soul on this planet, having high life force, highly nutritious food, no strings attached.

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I absolutely love it, and I will make sure that I include links to you, to your Instagram to where people can reach you in the show notes. So please go out and check it out. So if you’re looking to create any kind. And right now, literally, anything, any, just even a small container garden, even just one pot, one houseplant, just one houseplant like

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start it off, get into it, and Spence is a wonderful resource for you. And also, if you want to talk about the communication side and how to expand your ability to communicate with plants, please.

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You know that that’s why the naturally conscious community exists. It’s to create that safe space where we can reconnect with Nature’s wisdom and support each other in finding grounding and clarity and connection. And also, if you’re looking for a little extra, you know, help to navigate your overall journey. You know that I’m always here for you. I’d love to work with you, one on one I’d love for you to reach out to people like Spence and all the other guests that we have

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on this show, because together we’re going to create personalized approaches that really help you reconnect with your center to reconnect with the true essence of your being as a being of nature, and that way you can be resilient and start to thrive, no matter what life brings your way. So

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thank you so much, Spence, and for all of you listening. If this episode resonated with you, remember to like to comment, to subscribe, you know all those important things, because every time that you share these ideas you help make Spence’s dream of everybody having food sovereignty a little bit closer to home, plus. We want to grow a community of like-minded individuals who

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really want to live in harmony with Nature’s wisdom. And so thank you so much for being a part of this space.

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I know that we’re going to continue to explore and navigate these types of conversations, and so, really looking forward to embracing more of what nature teaches us. So that’s it for this episode. Remember to resist the urge to hold back your emerging green brilliance. That’s it for us. We’re gone bye.

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Thanks for tuning in to this episode of ReConnect with Plant Wisdom to continue these conversations, join us in the naturally conscious community. Your premier online ecosystem for plant reawakening and accelerated evolution and co-creation with other kin.

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Here you’ll find expansive discussions, interactive courses, live events and supportive group programs like the plant Wisdom Book Club, and the Sprouts, writing and Creativity group

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connect with like-minded individuals collaborating with plants to integrate these insights into life, intro and outro music by Steve Sciulli and Poinsettia from the singing life of plants. That’s it for me, Tigrilla Gardenia and my plant collaborators until next time. Remember, resist the urge to hold back your emerging green brilliance. I’m out bye.